Experiments in "not-selling"
What if we didn’t sell?? That’s the question Amy asks in this week’s episode where she outlines her 2023 experiment in not selling.
In this episode she dives into:
Her most epic launch failure to date
The epiphany that led to experimenting with not selling
What she’s defining as “selling” vs “not selling” this year
The two main experiments she’s exploring around “sales without selling” this year
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[0:04] Welcome to Breathe Into Business, a podcast for folks who want to hear what it's really like to run an intuitive-led business. I'm your host, Amy Koretsky, a breathwork facilitator who helps,
service providers, course creators, and artists tap into their own inner knowing so that they can run,
businesses from a place of trust and self-confidence. I created this podcast to.
Help folks like you who are disillusioned with the overculture of online small business building to permission yourself to follow a different path. In these episodes, you'll hear conversations that,
are direct, messy, and even a little bit scary at times. My biggest hope is that each of these,
episodes helps you feel even 10% more confident in leaning into what your intuition is sharing.
[0:50] With you and doing business your own way. Now, let's take a breath and talk business.
Hey there everyone, it is Amy and you are listening to Breathe Into Business. Thank you so much for being here. You know, before we get started, I just want to really give a heartfelt thank you
to everybody who reached out with emails or voice notes or all of the well wishes and prayers that worse out my way before my surgery recently. If you don't know what I'm talking about and are new
here and want to get caught up on some of the things that have been going on in my life and my business, I will link in the show notes to the most recent podcast episode and one of my newsletters where I kind of share what's been going on recently. But I just want to say that.
[1:47] Surgery went well and I am feeling pretty good, all things considered, and I'm slowly making my way back into my regular routine. And just I'm really grateful for all of you and your well wishes,
your love, your all the things basically. So thank you so much. So let's maybe take a breath together.
I know that I could use one. I'm guessing maybe you could too and we'll get into the episode. So just maybe place your feet flat on the ground if you're somewhere where you can take a minute and if you're walking or driving, just, you know, keep doing what you're doing,
but take an intentional moment to let all the air out of your lungs and then breathe in deeply.
[2:40] And then let it all go. Okay, let's get started. So one thing that I've always really believed in my business and in the businesses of the people that I mentor and work with and coach is that.
[2:58] We are all running experiments in our businesses all the time, whether we realize it or not, whether we are consciously gathering and analyzing data or not, it is just something
that it is happening. Some of us are maybe doing it a little bit more haphazardly and kind of throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing what sticks and some of us are really kind of going
at it with a more scientific method sort of mindset and really choosing certain variables that we want to work with. I feel really lucky that one of my like business superpowers is that,
I really thrive in experimentation. I really learn in experimentation both the kind of successful aspects of experiments but also the failure aspects. Those are really helpful for me and
I'm somebody who isn't afraid of failing. It's something that I've done many, many times and and will continue to do many times more.
And I've always learned so much from every like quote unquote failure that I've had.
And I'm gonna give you a real behind the scenes look one of my failures today in this episode.
[4:15] For those of you who are interested in like human design, which as a caveat, I will say I am interested in it, but I don't actually know that much about it. I am not somebody who is like qualified to speak at length about human design.
But from the little bit of research I've done and from the one or two readings that I've had read for me about my human design chart, I guess I'm a one-three generator. And the one-three aspect of my chart is something that.
[4:51] Shows that I do really well with experimentation. I was just looking this up again recently, and there was a quote in my reading that says that the one-three has two fundamental qualities
from which they thrive, research and discovery. And I feel like that totally defines me to a T.
It is exactly the sort of thing that I am always doing in my business. And even in my life, you know, research and discovery is something that I put into my creative practices, into my own,
health challenges that I'm going through right now. I'm going through all sorts of things where where I'm doing all this research and discovery and experimentation as to what feels good in my body,
what my body's capabilities are, the things that make my body thrive,
and the things that make my body kind of fall apart a little bit more.
And I'm taking all of that information in and then processing it and moving forward with it.
[5:56] And so I'm just a real big fan of experiments. And if you come back here in a couple of weeks and listen to the next episode that we'll be dropping.
It's a conversation with my good friend, Dr. Katie Peplin from Thrive PhD.
And that we are going to be talking all about experiments in business. It is something that Katie does all the time in her own business and when she's working with her clients who are PhD students.
And it's just a great conversation. So please come back and listen to that in a couple of weeks, especially if you want to talk about this further.
[6:33] But today we are gonna talk about a really big experiment, like a really big intentional experiment that I am gonna be running this year, 2023, right where we are right now.
And that experiment is one of not selling.
[6:53] Yes, you heard that right. Here I am, a business owner, specifically saying that I'm not going to be selling this year.
And it might be blowing your mind to hear me say these words, but that is the truth of the matter. And it's exciting to me to kind of be a little transgressive in this way and say that I'm not gonna be selling at all this year.
[7:15] So let me give you the back story and then we'll go a little bit deeper into what this experiment is actually going to look like. So here's the back story and hopefully this isn't too windy and that you are able to follow along and it all makes sense.
But basically, you know, about a year ago, I had a really beautiful download come through during a breathwork session.
And the download was all about bringing together a small kind of intimate cohort of people to work with in more of a group coaching method.
And to bring them through what I've now kind of come to discover are my six pillars of doing business differently, which you've all probably familiar with now because I talked about that a lot in I think it was episode two of this season of the podcast.
You can always go back to that one and listen to it if you want a refresher.
But the download was that I am supposed to gather together a small group of people and work together in group coaching, group mentorship.
And this was pretty different for me because I'd been really working just one-on-one with people for, you know, since the inception of my coaching business.
[8:37] I've done, you know, workshops and retreats and some other offerings where we're working in group settings, but those had always kind of been one-off things.
And the download that I was getting in this breathwork session was that it was supposed to be a longer term container where we're really forming relationships that are going to grow beyond the time that we spend together there and they're going to be like kind of.
Lifelong friendship sort of things.
And...
[9:07] Everything was just like coming in so clearly so easily and it felt both kind of scary but also really exciting and really easeful and I was like all right great we're doing this and honestly within.
[9:20] A week of getting that download I outlined what that entire program was going to look like.
I had a couple people in mind of who would be a great fit. I think another one of my superpowers is I'm one of those, what do they call them, like super connectors. And I always am really.
[9:40] Really amazing at like connecting people together that then go on to have really fulfilling friendships or business collaborations or partnerships in different ways. And so I was
really wanting to be intentional with who I invited into this space because I didn't want to just like throw it out there and get a bunch of random people together and maybe it was going to be the
the right fit or not. I was really intentional. I had a couple people in mind and I basically just wrote up a couple emails. I think I wrote like six emails, sent them out. Four people,
you know, pretty quickly responded back and were like, yes, I am in sign me up. You know, where do I where do I pay you money? How do we make this happen? I had one person who was like, this sounds amazing, but the timing just doesn't end right for me. So like, let me know if you do this again. And then I had one person that was like, this sounds great,
but it's not right for me right now. And I was like, okay, cool. And so I had my first beta group and we did, we did the incubator program together and it was phenomenal. It was lovely. You've met some of them already through the interviews that I've had on this.
Season. You're going to meet more of them soon. Like I said, Katie's going to be on next week.
[10:54] It was just a really sweet group and it was lovely and it went so easefully and the connections that were being made were just so synchronous and everything about it just felt right. It was
great and I was like wonderful, hell yeah, I did it. Like this is how I'm meant to be working going forward and you know as someone who has been in business for a long time and has been trying to to not necessarily pull back on my one-on-one work.
[11:26] But just more consciously choose how I spend my time.
[11:35] The idea of doing less one-on-one sessions and more group work sounded really appealing to me.
And I was like, great, spirit wants this to happen. It came through so easily. And everyone was so thrilled with it. And it was such a positive experience that obviously this is how I'm supposed to be working now.
And I changed a whole bunch of things in the structure of my business to make this a more reoccurring offering. And I was going to offer it twice a year. And this is how we were going to work going forward.
And so that first beta launch was I didn't really have to sell it at all.
All I did is send a couple of emails. I sent like six emails and didn't write a sales page. There was like nothing extravagant or persuasive about it. It was literally an email that had kind of
bullet points over the things that we were going to go over and the details and how much it was going to cost and the dates and like that was that. And so then when it came around time to
actually getting ready to launch the first public offering of the incubator, which was this past fall, so like September of 2022.
[12:48] I'm not going to make you wait for it. I will just say that it was a failure. Like truly it was a launch failure.
And it's funny because I know there's a lot of people out there talking about their successful launches, but I don't think there's a whole lot of people in the online business world that talk about their launch failures.
And this was truly one of them.
I was voxering with some of my business friends around that time. And I was like, whoa, y'all, like, this is what's happening.
And everyone was saying, like, you know, we've all been there.
We've all had things that we've promoted that have just fallen flat. And no one really talks about this publicly.
So they were all really encouraging me to like share about this more publicly. And I was like, I will, I will, I promise it'll get on the podcast at some point. I just need to wait until the right time.
[13:47] Here we are now, it feels like the right time. Basically what happened is I did a launch for it.
I wouldn't necessarily say went like full throttle, like I didn't do a webinar, I didn't do like any of those things,
but I did do an opt-in, I did do a bit of a wait list, I did do a sales page, I did do sales email funnels, I did all of those things.
And let's be honest here, it's not that surprising to me that I am somebody that says I want to do business differently.
And it's because I do actually want to do business differently.
And here I was kind of selling in a really traditional way. So it's not surprising to me that it fell flat.
Because when I look back on it, it's not exactly true to who I am or how I work or how I want to show up and work.
[14:42] And so, you know, I did sell some spots in it. There was one that sold right away and it was basically the person who I had invited into the beta round who the timing didn't work for them and they signed up for this round.
[14:56] And my lovely and amazing friend and client, Lindsay Mack, had given me a shout out about it on her podcast, which gets a whole lot more listens to every week than my podcast does.
And that sent me a couple of people.
But it wasn't enough people to necessarily be financially sustainable for me.
You know, I wasn't gonna be putting, I knew what the limit was. I knew what the minimum number was that I needed to have sign up for it in order for it to be a viable option for me in my business.
And I didn't reach that number. So I made the decision, you know,
after the sales window closed and I had not met the number I needed, I cried and I had my feelings about it and I like journaled about it a bit and I talked about it with some friends.
But then I also kind of realized that once again, failures are always data and information and things that I learned from.
And what I was able to do in that moment was pivot, which is something I am really good at doing.
I am a pivoting fucking pro.
And in that moment I pivoted and I reached out to the, you know, four different people that had signed up and was like, hey, here's the deal.
[16:16] We didn't get enough people for this to actually happen, but we got a couple options.
I can refund your money, more than happy to do that. Or we can transition this work into one-on-one work and we will go through the same six different pillars.
We'll go through the same content, but we will work together in a one-on-one capacity it's just going to look a little bit different.
And amazingly, every single one of them was like, great, sounds good, sign me up, let's work together one on one. So that felt like a win in and of inside of a failure. So there's kind of,
the backstory. Oh, I have a side, I have a side story that I really want to tell you as well.
And this is more of a maybe less of a story and more of a theory that I have about how the universe works when we set boundaries with ourselves.
[17:15] So I believe that when we set a boundary with ourselves, in this case, my boundary was like, if I don't get more, if I don't get six people to sign up for this, I can't run it. You know, like I need six people to make this work.
[17:30] That was the boundary I set. And here's the funny thing that happened. I had four people sign up and then the card closed.
And so I said, OK, it's not happening anymore. And I started to write the emails that I was going to send to the people to see what they wanted to do if they wanted their money back or whatnot.
And in that period of time, I had at least two other people reach out and be like, oh, is it too late or like, oh, I'm still kind of on the fence about this, but like, can you explain this to me a little bit more?
[17:59] And so on one hand, I could have I could have shown up with a lot of like, kind of scarcity or fear and been like, oh, see, see, I made the wrong decision.
I closed it too soon. I was supposed to wait longer. And I could have like, you know, grasped at these straws and grasped at these people that are showing up late and like kind of made it work.
When obviously they weren't like.
Necessarily write for the program because if they were they wouldn't have waited till like after the cart closed, you know, so I could have shown up that way. But I didn't because what I have come to believe is that when we set a boundary.
With the universe or like with ourselves, the universe spirit, whatever word you want to use is inevitably going to test us on that. Like it's going to happen no matter what it's going to happen. And so we kind of have two different choices.
One, we can, you know, we can be tested and we can succumb to those fears that we made the wrong decision the first time and like go back on our word. our word or we can kind of hold firm in what we decided and be like, no, I made this decision,
I feel secure in my reasons for making this decision and I'm going to go forward with it.
[19:17] And so what I've kind of decided over the years is neither of those options feel really good. Like it hurts to kind of go back on your word, but it also kind of hurts to have to stand so
stoically in our decision. And I like to make things fun. I would prefer to have things feel joyful and playful and fun as opposed to painful and stoic all the time. And so I came up with this
game several years ago, like, gosh, maybe before we even had the acupuncture clinic. And so this is probably like 2016, 2017. I came up with this game, which is as soon as I set a boundary with the universe, I make a bet with myself and I say, I wonder how quickly I'm gonna get tested on this.
And and then it's a game and then like inevitably I get tested and I get to see was my bet with myself on or was it off? Like did I say oh I'm gonna get tested on this within 24 hours and then I get tested in 48 hours or is it like 24 hours on the dot?
[20:23] I will say that sometimes I get tested as quickly as like 30 minutes after I set the boundary and like bet myself as to how long it's gonna take. Sometimes it happens very, very fast.
So this is all to say that it was not a surprise to me when these people showed up after the card has closed, you know, giving me this invitation to go back on my boundary. And at that point,
I was like, had already made this decision that like, no, we're going to just do it one on one from here on out. Like this is how it's going to be. So that's my side story.
[21:00] So while this is all happening, while I'm having this epic failure of a launch, there is another thing happening at the exact same moment. At the exact same moment,
I am in Arizona. I'm in Phoenix, Arizona, at the most gorgeous retreat space that you could imagine.
It was this house that was literally built for retreats. So there were 11 bedrooms and every bedroom had its own ensuite. Like we all had our own attached bathrooms in this beautiful retreat
space in the middle of Phoenix with a pool in the backyard and this gorgeous kitchen that was like the most lovely thing ever. And I had been brought out there by an amazing woman to help co-facilitate.
[21:54] A retreat where I was leading breathwork and I was reading tarot cards and I was holding ceremonial space for the attendees. And so it was such an interesting dichotomy of two completely
opposite things happening at the same time. On one hand, I have this launch that is just,
epically failing. Like when I was in Arizona, it was while the cart was still open. So it was before I had made the decision to move people to a one-on-one and before they had agreed to that.
And it was really when I was still in this place of like, all right, I literally have only sold one ticket so far. What the fuck is happening? I thought this was how I was supposed to work going
forward. And at the exact same time, I'm in Arizona, leading and facilitating and having the time of my life and getting paid to do it and just like having so much fun out there.
And it was so interesting to have these two things happen at the exact same time. So that's our backstory that kind of gives you the lay of the land of what led up to my big epiphany,
that I'm not supposed to be selling.
[23:05] So basically after Arizona, I come back home. I'm on a walk and talk with my good business bestie, Nicole Antoinette. We're like, you know, it's beautiful out, it's fall. We're each on our
phones in our respective places where we live, walking the dog, having a conversation. And we're talking about how hard it can be to sell. And she's going off about something that she's selling in in that moment.
And I have this moment where I'm like, I don't think I'm supposed to sell anymore.
And she's like, what are you talking about?
And I was like, I don't think I'm supposed to sell. Every time that I put something out there into the world and quote unquote try to sell it, it really falls flat.
[23:51] And I have other data here that I can go back on. Different things from one-off workshops or other sort of programs that I've tried selling in the past.
My newsletter list isn't gigantic, but it's not insignificant either.
And generally, I think they talk about on average with online business, you can generally expect like a 2% conversion at a minimum or about 2% for anything that you're selling to an email list.
And even with my size of an email list, I wasn't selling at 2% conversion, which is pretty disappointing, to be honest.
[24:36] And so I was like, every single thing that I have made decent money on in the last 12 months has been something that I did not sell.
It was like this retreat in Arizona. The person came to me. I didn't know who they were before they invited me to go out there.
We got to know each other over the course of a year before the retreat happened, so I felt comfortable doing it. But that invitation just landed in my lap.
Some of the other most profitable and enjoyable events that I facilitated over the last year have been things where people reached out to me to work for them and do something.
Even things like Nicole, my friend, who I was on the phone with, she will often have me lead breathwork at her retreats online events for her Patreon community. And she pays me for those, but I'm not like going up to her being like, Hey, when can I do the next one? You know, she just reaches out to me and says,
Hey, I've got an event. Do you want to, are you free this day? Do you want to work for me this day?
And so I was having this moment in this conversation with her where I was like, every single way that I've made money in the last couple of years that have been and really fruitful and enjoyable and all these things.
[25:53] That money has just kind of landed in my lap. I haven't gone out looking for it or gone out trying to sell for it.
So in that moment, I kind of decided I don't think I'm supposed to sell going forward. And it was a big aha moment.
And I talk about this a little bit more in the episode five from this season where I'm having the end of the year reflection conversation with another one of my best besties, Shawna Bryant.
So if you want to hear more about, you know, some of the epiphanies that we both had in the last year.
You can listen to that episode.
[26:26] But like I said, my takeaway from that conversation was that I have the most fun and make the most money in my business when I create space for exciting opportunities to just arrive on my doorstep.
So this all leads to a hypothesis that I am making for 2023. And my hypothesis is this.
[26:49] I believe that I can match or even increase my 2022 income in 2023 without selling. And I'm putting selling in quotation marks here because of how I'm defining selling for the purposes of
this experiment. And I love semantics. I love words. And so I decided to look up what the internet says the definition of the word selling is. And I got two definitions here. And I think this is.
Really perfect for this example in this episode, because the first definition was.
[27:27] That selling is to give or hand over something in exchange for money.
And let's be clear, I am absolutely going to be doing that this year. I am going to be exchanging you know, services for money.
I'm a business, that's how we survive, that's gonna happen.
[27:44] Though as a side note, my capitalist critiquing heart has long been a part of the bartering economy and I am totally down for alternative economies like that. So if you have something that you think I need and I have something that you think you need and you want to barter,
hit me up. I'm always down for that conversation. So in that respect, I will absolutely be selling this year. However, the second definition that I saw was this, it said to persuade somebody
of the merits of blank. And I'm saying that this definition is what I'm choosing not to engage in this year. And so it's the word persuade that really is rubbing me the wrong way.
[28:32] Because I kind of want to think about this idea, and maybe you've thought about this idea before too, because it's not a brand new idea in the world of online business or business in general,
but the idea of the difference between hunting and fishing, and let's even add farming to this.
When we hunt for new clients, we're actively going out there and searching for them. So you can think of that as like.
[29:04] You know, selling advertising, you're like putting ads out into the world to try to like nab clients, you're, you know, making really, I'm going to use the word aggressive here,
you're making aggressive moves to go out and like convince or persuade or like grab clients and to bring them back to you. So that would be like hunting for clients. And then there's this idea
of like fishing for clients. And that's maybe more the idea that we are basing our marketing.
Off of creating content. So we maybe make really engaging TikTok content or Instagram content or podcasts content or blogs or anything like that. And we're putting so much educational and informative
and enjoyable content out in the world that it is attracting or like fishing. We're enticing clients to us through that method.
And I don't necessarily think there's anything wrong with that. I mean, I'm doing that here through creating this podcast.
However, that's also not how I necessarily want to be selling that this year. Like you I'm fine with you being enticed by this content and coming into my ecosystem, but I'm not necessarily directly than selling you anything.
[30:25] And then the last one is what I'm thinking of like farming. In farming we plant seeds, we nurture them, we tend to them as they grow slowly, we maybe weed them as things pop up that we, you know, that don't necessarily serve our businesses needs, we weed those out.
And eventually we have the patience for things to grow and come to maturity so that we can and pluck them when the time is right.
[30:53] And maybe even plucking them isn't totally the right analogy here, but even just like, imagine the tomato just falling off the vine at exactly the right time and like rolling onto my plate. Obviously that would never happen, but let's just imagine for this purpose.
[31:11] And one of the reasons why this farming analogy feels really appropriate to me right now is that during this whole time, during that whole fall, when I was having this like failure of launch and
and all of these things. I was pulling the Seven of Pentacles over and over and over again in my tarot pulls. And obviously a more traditional reading of the Seven of Pentacles is like patience,
like there's a lot of patience in the Seven of Pentacles. But what I was seeing in that card in that moment was like, you know, for all of these things over the last couple years where opportunities have landed in my lap. It's not that they just come out of like absolute nowhere.
[31:55] Like yeah I'm not asking for those opportunities necessarily, but they're also not totally out of the realm of the imagination. Usually they were showing up because of relationships that I had
built with people over the years that were finally and eventually coming to fruition in different ways. And so I was thinking about the seven of pentacles in terms of networking, like all of
these seeds that I was planting were these relationships that I was initiating or that were being initiated towards me and that we would slowly and intentionally and gradually develop and
grow over the years. And then eventually they came to the point where the fruit was ripe and ready to be harvested. So this is all to say that I'm not going to I'm not interested in persuading.
[32:47] Anybody. I am here to kind of share what I do welcome folks into my ecosystem who want to work with me. It's this idea of like, you know, maybe I'll invite people in, but I'm not necessarily
gonna sell them. Does this make sense? I'm hoping this makes sense. So you know to get really clear.
[33:11] I did this for myself. Like I needed some clarity around okay what do I define as selling and what do I not define as selling? And yes that whole hunting versus fishing versus farming analogy is one way to define how I want to sell this year, but I needed to get more specific.
I'm a Capricorn rising. I like really needed to be practical. I needed to know exactly what this looks like. I also have a Mercury and Virgo. So like I really like details and specifics,
and then bullet points. So I needed to make a list that had bullet points.
[33:48] To tell me like, what were my definitions of like, what is selling and what is not selling? What am I willing to do this year? And what am I not willing to do? It's kind of like, for those of you who are familiar with my yes, no list, it was kind of like a yes, no list when it comes to selling. which also reminds me like I think there was a thing this year, which I'm behind the times when
it comes to like social media, but I think it was really popular this year to do like in and out lists. So you can kind of think of this as my like own version of a selling in like what's in when
it comes to selling, what's out when it comes to selling this year. So we're gonna go over that together just because I like to share what my brain is doing. And I bet you're curious to know what my definitions of selling and not selling are for this year.
[34:40] So what I will not be doing, what my no list is, what I'm not willing to do to sell this year is this. I am not willing to write email funnels.
Nope, just not happening. There are no email funnels happening at all in my business this year.
I will make one slight exception to that, which is that the opt-in that I have on my website is technically, I guess, a sales funnel because it's like a five-day drip email challenge.
It's a five-day breathwork challenge, but it's something that I've had for years. It is something that people love.
Honestly, I've met some really good friends because they have signed up for that years and years ago and then we become friends over the years. Like Nicole, that's actually how
we met as she signed up for my breathwork challenge. And so it doesn't feel salesy to me. Plus like the only thing it's really selling is breathwork itself. So like, I'm cool with that like I'm cool with selling breathwork because yeah I want more people to do breathwork.
[35:48] So that one I don't consider an email funnel, but other than that, no email funnels. They stress me out to write.
They stress me out to send email after email after email.
They're like not totally consensual, although I have some, I take some issue to that because I feel like if you're signing up for somebody's email list, you should expect that they're going to sell to you at some point.
So like I don't really have a problem with that.
[36:16] But this is all to say it's not happening. So if you get an email funnel from me this year, you got to like reach out to me and be like, Amy, what's going on with you? Because I thought you said that there were no email funnels.
Like I want to take your temperature. Is everything okay?
[36:32] Okay. So along those lines, if there are no email funnels, that also means that there are no launches because usually launches go hand in hand with email funnels.
[36:43] And I am like, so done with launches. I wrote in like huge letters in my journal.
It's like no launches, none, never, no more. Which means that that also I can't create any new products that actually require a launch for it to be viable or successful.
Which is kind of a big deal. But it's a big deal because I have tried it over and over and over in the seven years that I've been in business.
And guess what? It doesn't work for me. And I just need to learn that already, even though every other online marketing person on the internet is like, whatever about launches and about group programs or all these different things that kind of require a launch.
That is not for me anymore. So there are going to be no products or services that require a launch in order for it to be viable or successful.
Which is partly why there's not going to be an incubator group this spring like there originally was planned to be. And I know that might be a disappointment to some of you listening,
but I promise you that there are going to be other ways that we can work together that still include that content and are still really beautiful and thriving and supportive ways to work together.
[38:10] But that's all to say no incubator group going forward. Another thing that is on my no list is no advertising. It's not something I currently do, but I'm just naming that I also
don't want to start doing it. And then the last thing I wrote on my no list was nothing that feels persuasive, salesy, pushy, or just icky in my body. And that's a little bit more ambiguous
because I can't always name what's going to feel icky in my body. But this is me naming that I I honor and acknowledge the wisdom that my body holds.
And that that is important to me.
So I'm putting it on this list.
[38:53] So those are all my no things. So I bet you're wondering, well, if those are what I'm not doing this year, what am I giving myself permission to do?
And not just like permission, but like explicit permission, like encouragement. Like these are the ways that I wanna put my work out in the world and engage with clients past, present, and future.
So this is my yes list.
So number one on that is a given.
It is giving 100% to my clients, my current clients, as my main priority. Most of the people that I've worked with that have been my absolute favorite clients to work with, they come from direct referrals, usually from other clients.
And so this is such a easy way for me to, you know, quote unquote, sell is to like do good work and have that work ripple out into the world.
You know, it also means that I'm giving myself explicit permission to ask for referrals from my clients when I have open spaces.
[40:02] I would much rather just reach out to them and be like, Hey, do you know anyone that's looking for the sort of work that I do right now, I have space for one more person.
And seeing if they do, there's no harm in asking.
And they know most intimately how I work. And so they would probably have a good sense of which of their friends would be a good fit for me.
[40:24] So that's one way that I'm going to be selling this year. Another way is that I'm going to be creating content like these podcasts so that folks like you can kind of get to know me and
understand my work and my values and my philosophies. And yes, this goes more to that fishing analogy that I was putting out there before. But I don't think that there's anything wrong with having that
be part of my marketing ecosystem. I just don't want to put all of my fishes in one basket. Is,
that the phrase? I don't think I'm saying that right, but I think you get the point.
[41:07] And you know, obviously my hope with that is that like by forming these relationships, granted I know that you can hear me, but I can't necessarily hear you unless you reach out with an email or voice note, which I encourage you to do. You know, there's still a relationship being formed,
and my hope is that, you know, at some point you might choose to join the Patreon community and join me for monthly community breathwork. And so showing up here regularly and sharing.
What I want to share in this kind of really authentic way is hopefully, you know, eventually doing that. What else am I doing? So the other thing on my yes list is that I'm going to be
tending to my network. So that seven of pentacles work that I was talking about, that networking,
that planting seeds, nurturing them, growing them, having the patience to know that they will become ripe when they are meant to. And some of those relationships are going to be ripe in a couple
weeks and some of those it's going to take several years and that's okay. And I want to give a quick shout out to Michelle Warner's Networking That Pays course that I took a couple years ago and really really got a lot out of and so if you're someone who's like oh networking no thank you.
[42:31] She talks about networking from a much more like introverted way and it's not about going out to a bunch of events and giving your business card to everyone or anything like that. It's about making real connections, real friendships, real supportive two-way relationships.
[42:50] And I will say that like, I think I mentioned this already, but all of these really amazing opportunities that have come to me over the last couple years have really been the fruit of these sort of networking relationships over the years. And that's one area of my business that I really want to intentionally grow this year.
I love doing private events, you know, for other people's retreats, for other people's communities and masterminds.
[43:19] I love introducing breathwork to groups of people that already have a community connection between them and giving them one more tool to relate to each other and relate to themselves with and so that's something I want to put more intentional work towards.
And so tending to my network is going to be one way of fulfilling that that selling in a different way.
What else? Okay, I'm also going to be sending emails to let people know how they can work with me.
And you might say, well, isn't that selling Amy? And like, yes, technically that's selling. But these are not going to be like persuasive, like sales page, like let me like poke you in
the pain point, and then tell you how I'm going to fix that pain point and then give you all this social proof through testimonials.
Like it's not gonna be that sort of email. It's more just gonna be like, hey, if you wanna work together this year, this is what I offer and this is my current availability and this is how you can get ahold of me.
And like just be really.
[44:25] Really factual because like I said before, if you're on somebody's email list, you should expect it at some point they're going to ask you to work with them or ask you to give them money or something.
[44:37] And I think that's totally appropriate. And I'm more than happy to like do that because I also think it's just kind of like kind to tell people and not make them like do all of the legwork of being like, oh wait, going on my website and searching for this and searching for that.
And it's like, here, here's the deal.
Want to work with me? This is how we can do it. Plain and simple. Okay, so that was the fourth one. And then the fifth way that I'm going to be selling this year is like really similar to that
last one about just sending emails that are really factual. I'm also going to be sending some emails here and there that are just keeping people up to date on different events, whether it's like in,
person events, like the breathwork classes that I do at YesYoga here in Minneapolis, or like online events like the group breathwork that we do through the Patreon community. I know that people have
really busy schedules and it's really hard to always know what is going on out there. So I think it's really kind to just be like, hey, just in case you forgot about this and you're free and
you want to join us, here's this thing we're doing. Really recently, I had an online group for the Patreon community. And so I wasn't initially planning on sending an email to my newsletter and then at the last minute I was like,
oh, you know, it'll only take me 10 minutes to put this together.
I might as well just send it out and let people know that this is happening.
[46:00] And I did and I got like an extra 10 or 12 people joining us because of that. So it's like that's a win right there.
Might as well send it even if even if it wasn't originally planned.
So that is my no and yes list when it comes to selling.
Thank you for bearing with me. I know this episode has actually gotten longer than I was expected, but here we are getting to the experiment part.
So let me tell you now how I'm going to run an experiment around this whole not selling thing.
[46:33] Because you know when we're dealing with experiments, we're dealing with variables and then collecting data. And granted, this is the beginning of the year, I'm really only just starting to think about how I want to run these experiments. So these might change. And maybe.
You'll hear from me in a later episode at the end of the season, where we'll recap what has been the results. But I have a feeling that I'm not going to fully understand the results of some of these
experiments for like six or 12 months. So these are kind of longer term experiments that I'm willing to have patience to put in this effort or to work in this different way, not always knowing that the
results that I theoretically want are coming when I want them to come. So this really has a lot of of like trust and surrender in it.
[47:21] Okay, so there's two basic experiments I'm gonna be running.
The first one is that I'm gonna do my best to create as much space in my schedule as I can so that the opportunities and adventures that I wanna go on this year can have space to arrive.
I mentioned before that like all of the favorite things that I did to make money last year just landed on my doorstep. And if my schedule is too busy, I know that those things won't have space to.
[47:52] Populate my inbox and populate my calendar. So the variables that I'm adjusting this are that you maybe have heard this already, but I'm taking an oh, much overdue sabbatical from patient care at
the acupuncture clinic. So I'm pulling back my hours and a little bit of my responsibility at the clinic. I'm still going to be running the show over there with Kim. I'm not going anywhere
necessarily, but there is a big kind of energetic space that's being lifted off of my shoulders by doing this. I'm also moving all of my client work, my coaching client work to Voxer only.
[48:31] That's something I've been slowly transitioning over the last year, but now that we're moving into 2023, when a couple of my last current coaching clients complete their package with me,
that I'm moving to Voxer completely. And what that's really done is like create a lot more space on my schedule for fun and interesting opportunities to arrive. And the best thing
about that change, which like that's an experiment that I've kind of been running for the last six months already. And I fucking love it. I love it so much because I feel like my clients are getting way more out of our work together when they have access to me in the moment when they need it,
as opposed to going through something challenging and then needing to wait a week and a half or two and a half weeks until our next appointment. They have access to me immediately. And when it comes.
[49:29] To this even idea of time for money, I feel like it's a wash because I feel like I'm easily spending as much time with my clients like minute for minute, hour for hour over Voxer over the course of a month than I was when we were doing like one hour calls.
Like I'm spending more time with them now, but it actually feels more easeful for my schedule because it's happening, you know, in moments when I'm like folding laundry or walking the dog or like when I choose to do it, which might be in off hours.
And as somebody who's living in a body right now that has its own timeline of when it is working and when it's not working, it is so much more easeful for me to choose when I am available to listen to messages and respond than to be like, oh body, we have to be working in the next hour.
And my body's like, nope, nope, we're not working in the next hour. So.
[50:26] That's something that I already feel I'm seeing the benefits of that experiment, but I'm kind of like kicking it up a notch and taking it to the next level.
[50:34] So the data that I'm going to be collecting around this experiment is like, I want to see how many invitations I get to facilitate at different events. I want to see how many coaching inquiries I receive. I'm interested to see if those numbers go up with me taking those other things down.
I want to see how nurtured my networks become. My hope is that with more space in my calendar, I actually can have more spontaneous interactions
with my network and maybe have tea dates or phone dates or walk and talk dates with more friends or different things where I'm nurturing those connections even more deeply.
I also want to notice how much fun I'm having at work. Am I enjoying my work more?
And then of course, I'm going to look at my income each month and see if my income goes up or down.
And I might not look at it on like a month by month basis. It might be more of like an average, but it's still something I'm gonna be looking at.
[51:31] And then the second experiment that I'm going to be doing around this idea of not selling is something that I just started, which was I moved my monthly breathwork over to Patreon.
And I'm really excited about that. Many of you know that I used to have a monthly breathwork and then the pandemic really wore me out in a lot of ways and I got really zoomed out and I narrowed that session down to just paying clients.
And then right now I've decided to open it back up and it's now open to anyone that's part of my Patreon community.
And it's so nice. We had our first one the other night and it was such a beautiful group of people coming together, people who have been breathing with me for years and a couple people who it was only their second time ever breathing with me.
And we had so many interesting ways that the breath showed up for everyone. And we did a little journaling before the breathing and then the breathing and then the sharing afterwards. And it was just a really sweet group.
[52:31] And the reason why I decided to move that to Patreon instead of just selling it on my website is that, you know, Patreon is a monthly membership subscription. So when people sign up, they are automatically enrolled every single month until they choose to leave.
And so it's it feels like less selling for me. I bring them in once and then you're there.
You're automatically there every month. and you get to choose whether or not you show up, we always record it and share the recording afterwards so you never have to feel like you missed out if you weren't able to join us live.
But I'm really excited about that.
[53:07] And it's also feels like something less that I have to promote because I'm already kind of promoting the Patreon here on the podcast and I'll add it to a PS and my email every once in a while.
It's even I think in my signature of my regular email inbox. And so it's just kind of a natural part of how I talk about my business.
And so it feels less like selling and more as just a benefit that people get from already being a part of my community.
[53:36] So with that one, the data that I'm going to be collecting is obviously all kind of collect Patreon membership numbers and like income numbers around that. Like not only are people.
Joining or leaving the community, but you know, where are they on the scale? Because the way I'm doing my Patreon is that it's a sliding scale, like economically justice oriented sliding scale model. So it goes anywhere as low as five dollars a month and then the pay it forward, the like.
Highest level is thirty three dollars a month. And this is all to say that like if you come to like yes yoga and do breath work with me in person, it's like forty dollars. So the fact that there's
like a five dollar a month option is like ridiculously affordable. But you're also signing up to do it every single month. So there's that it's a benefit for me to have to know that you're going to be there month after month after month, that makes it worthwhile to have it at the lower price point.
[54:34] But I am interested also to see like, okay, do people just sign up at the lowest one because they're curious? And then do they stay there? Or do they see the value that they're getting and then,
go up the membership scale, go up the sliding scale, if their economic position allows them to?
Because it's not just supposed to be like $5 for everyone. The idea is that there's the higher end end of scale, the lower end of scale that it like middles out because there's people on both ends supporting the other end.
[55:03] So I'll be looking at that number. I'll be looking at the churn rate, which is that rate of people like leaving the membership in comparison to new enrollees.
And then I'm also going to look at like how much time or effort I'm putting into actually talking about Patreon and you know, quote unquote, selling that as a part of my ecosystem, because I don't necessarily want to have to put more time into that than I was before.
[55:28] Whew. I did not realize it was going to take me an hour to record this podcast. I hope you are still with me.
If you are, thank you. I appreciate each and every one of you.
Okay. So those are a few of the experiments that I'm doing this year to do less selling. Let me know if they resonated with you.
Like maybe you have an experiment of your own that you're excited to do now in your business. Maybe it has to do with selling or not selling.
I really want to hear about it if you do. You know, maybe even just sharing what your own yes, no list around selling or not selling looks like.
If you want to send me an email, I would love to receive it. And if you want to send me a voice note, I would love to receive that too.
You can go over to my podcast page at amykoretsky.com slash podcast, scroll down and you will see an option to record a voice note through PipeSpeak.
[56:25] Alright, that is it for today. Thank you so much for being here and listening to this whole episode. If selling brings up big feelings in your body as well, I'm going to encourage you to take a deep breath.
[56:40] Because you got this. Alright, bye y'all.
[56:48] Thanks so much for listening today. If you liked this episode, or even if it just got you to think about your business a little bit differently. I'd love for you to subscribe to the show and share it
with a business bestie or a few of them. And if you're interested in breathing more into your own business, I made something just for you. It's a five-day breathwork challenge for business owners.
Over five days, you'll learn how to use your breath to find deeper clarity and trust in yourself and in your business. You can find it at amykaretsky.com slash breathe. Breathe into business is recorded on the ancestral lands of the Dakota and Anishinaabe peoples. It is created by me,
Amy Koretsky, with the production help from Softer Sounds Studios. Thanks again for listening and and breathing into your business with me today.
[57:36] Music
